Thursday Scoreboard 2-28-19

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Jimjohn81
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Re: Thursday Scoreboard 2-28-19

Postby Jimjohn81 » March 4th, 2019, 11:29 pm

[font="Lucida Grande", "Trebuchet MS", Verdana, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]" If you aren't willing to do what other teams are, private or public, them quit hiding behind a system that has nothing to do with your failures. If and when you do what others are willing to do to be successful, and the system prevents you to be able to do so, then I will gladly join your crusade."    [/font]
[font="Lucida Grande", "Trebuchet MS", Verdana, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]What??? The system has nothing to do with your failures? Great coaching and building a program from the ground up are 1st[/font][font="Lucida Grande", "Trebuchet MS", Verdana, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif] but how can you even say the system is fair? I think we are well past that argument. I can co-o.p and take 50 percent of the population but certain schools can have 8 districts as Jim said about BC and they go man/man. certain publics with programs compete but who is saying Kennedy amd Neumann gorrettu and math civics and science are playing shanksville and Richland and north star on an even playing field?  When n.s. lost in finals I read an article that a girl from Neumann said that being ranked 1 in the nation was the best thing that happened to her since coming to the U.S.!! Come on N.S coach work harder, more camps. I'll link an article from Kennedy and you can read about the international recruiting there. Work harder public schools. I'm sure the kid going to WVU came through Kennedy's feeder system in his home country![/font]



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Jimjohn81
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Re: Thursday Scoreboard 2-28-19

Postby Jimjohn81 » March 4th, 2019, 11:30 pm


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Re: Thursday Scoreboard 2-28-19

Postby 12HankQB » March 5th, 2019, 8:38 am

SFB14 - Don't start with the program and working harder. That has nothing to do with it. It doesn't matter if JV beats BC or BG blows out West Branch, private schools still do not have the same random population as public schools. I'm not talking about recruiting, just the mere fact that anyone can go there vs having to live in a district. Whether that advantage is exploited or not it is an advantage no matter. Its the ability to have a population not built from natural selection in the district. This is why I want the separate playoffs. Not because of participation trophies or having 9 classes. I'm so tired of seeing so many good public schools losing to privates at the higher levels. It's not because of BG, BM, or BC. We know that locally the districts are competitive with them and they don't have the huge advantage that we see popping out of Pittsburgh or Philly. Though our locals privates still hold an advantage, I don't believe they exploit like those city schools, but they still have the ability and an advantage over public schools of equal size.
The only thing I don't like worse than a Philly charter loading up is a public school doing it. Unless a family has a legitimate reason to move, I hate when we see a star moving to another public school that strengthens their best sport. I've seen this in basketball in the WestPAC. One kid moving in small schools is huge. We can all name a local school that has had this happen. Whether legal or not by a board approving it. It is usually not as valid as it appears. I just wanted to let it be known that it's not just private schools I look at.
I beat a dead horse, but I don't care if privates have this ability or if they would recruit. It might be a better system if they're allowed to recruit. You could have some seriously awesome sports teams going at it every year. However, I do not want these teams going up against public schools to win a phony championship like Kennedy has done. Kennedy has to be a fun to watch, but would be better to watch against a team built from the same stone.
This doesn't that publics can't beat privates, it doesn't mean publics can't win championship because we know they do. All I want is a fair fight and fair rules. Too many people on here spin arguments with a straw man. 
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Re: Thursday Scoreboard 2-28-19

Postby SFB14 » March 5th, 2019, 10:59 am

12HankQB wrote:SFB14 - Don't start with the program and working harder. That has nothing to do with it. It doesn't matter if JV beats BC or BG blows out West Branch, private schools still do not have the same random population as public schools. I'm not talking about recruiting, just the mere fact that anyone can go there vs having to live in a district. Whether that advantage is exploited or not it is an advantage no matter. Its the ability to have a population not built from natural selection in the district. This is why I want the separate playoffs. Not because of participation trophies or having 9 classes. I'm so tired of seeing so many good public schools losing to privates at the higher levels. It's not because of BG, BM, or BC. We know that locally the districts are competitive with them and they don't have the huge advantage that we see popping out of Pittsburgh or Philly. Though our locals privates still hold an advantage, I don't believe they exploit like those city schools, but they still have the ability and an advantage over public schools of equal size.
The only thing I don't like worse than a Philly charter loading up is a public school doing it. Unless a family has a legitimate reason to move, I hate when we see a star moving to another public school that strengthens their best sport. I've seen this in basketball in the WestPAC. One kid moving in small schools is huge. We can all name a local school that has had this happen. Whether legal or not by a board approving it. It is usually not as valid as it appears. I just wanted to let it be known that it's not just private schools I look at.
I beat a dead horse, but I don't care if privates have this ability or if they would recruit. It might be a better system if they're allowed to recruit. You could have some seriously awesome sports teams going at it every year. However, I do not want these teams going up against public schools to win a phony championship like Kennedy has done. Kennedy has to be a fun to watch, but would be better to watch against a team built from the same stone.
This doesn't that publics can't beat privates, it doesn't mean publics can't win championship because we know they do. All I want is a fair fight and fair rules. Too many people on here spin arguments with a straw man. 

First of all Hank, don’t presume to tell me what i can start on and what I can’t. I’ll make any reasoned argument I’d like and if you don’t think there is any merit to my points then I’d suggest you don’t read them. I’m not discussing this anymore (I was stupid to weigh in, in the first place) because you (and most everyone else) have their minds made up. I’ve lived on both sides of the public/private debate and I’m trying to remain open minded. 
The system isn’t changing anytime soon. If I was a coach I’d operate under that presumption and work as hard as I could to succeed within it. All I know is I watched a game last week where one team started 4 guards under 6 feet tall and played at a different level than the opposing team. It sure looked like one team was much more prepared and skilled. I’m sure that has nothing to do with hard work and being exposed to better competition, but rather where they live. Enjoy the ongoing discussions, I’ll show myself out. 

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Re: Thursday Scoreboard 2-28-19

Postby GoldenRamsFAN » March 5th, 2019, 11:33 am

I know a lot of younger people that work hard. Just because you work hard doesn’t translate to being athletically gifted. It’s something you have, not learned. So when you have 50,000 POSSIBLE kids able to attend BG they should have better athletes then a 5k population of WB.

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Re: Thursday Scoreboard 2-28-19

Postby BasketballFan12345 » March 5th, 2019, 11:41 am

GoldenRamsFAN wrote:I know a lot of younger people that work hard. Just because you work hard doesn’t translate to being athletically gifted. It’s something you have, not learned. So when you have 50,000 POSSIBLE kids able to attend BG they should have better athletes then a 5k population of WB.

And Saint Joes and BC should be better to than JV with the area they can pull kids from (Ebensburg and State College). But they are not. 

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Re: Thursday Scoreboard 2-28-19

Postby GoldenRamsFAN » March 5th, 2019, 11:45 am

100 no’s and only 1 yes, is still a yes.

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Re: Thursday Scoreboard 2-28-19

Postby 12HankQB » March 5th, 2019, 12:00 pm

SFB14 wrote:
12HankQB wrote:SFB14 - Don't start with the program and working harder. That has nothing to do with it. It doesn't matter if JV beats BC or BG blows out West Branch, private schools still do not have the same random population as public schools. I'm not talking about recruiting, just the mere fact that anyone can go there vs having to live in a district. Whether that advantage is exploited or not it is an advantage no matter. Its the ability to have a population not built from natural selection in the district. This is why I want the separate playoffs. Not because of participation trophies or having 9 classes. I'm so tired of seeing so many good public schools losing to privates at the higher levels. It's not because of BG, BM, or BC. We know that locally the districts are competitive with them and they don't have the huge advantage that we see popping out of Pittsburgh or Philly. Though our locals privates still hold an advantage, I don't believe they exploit like those city schools, but they still have the ability and an advantage over public schools of equal size.
The only thing I don't like worse than a Philly charter loading up is a public school doing it. Unless a family has a legitimate reason to move, I hate when we see a star moving to another public school that strengthens their best sport. I've seen this in basketball in the WestPAC. One kid moving in small schools is huge. We can all name a local school that has had this happen. Whether legal or not by a board approving it. It is usually not as valid as it appears. I just wanted to let it be known that it's not just private schools I look at.
I beat a dead horse, but I don't care if privates have this ability or if they would recruit. It might be a better system if they're allowed to recruit. You could have some seriously awesome sports teams going at it every year. However, I do not want these teams going up against public schools to win a phony championship like Kennedy has done. Kennedy has to be a fun to watch, but would be better to watch against a team built from the same stone.
This doesn't that publics can't beat privates, it doesn't mean publics can't win championship because we know they do. All I want is a fair fight and fair rules. Too many people on here spin arguments with a straw man. 

First of all Hank, don’t presume to tell me what i can start on and what I can’t. I’ll make any reasoned argument I’d like and if you don’t think there is any merit to my points then I’d suggest you don’t read them. I’m not discussing this anymore (I was stupid to weigh in, in the first place) because you (and most everyone else) have their minds made up. I’ve lived on both sides of the public/private debate and I’m trying to remain open minded. 
The system isn’t changing anytime soon. If I was a coach I’d operate under that presumption and work as hard as I could to succeed within it. All I know is I watched a game last week where one team started 4 guards under 6 feet tall and played at a different level than the opposing team. It sure looked like one team was much more prepared and skilled. I’m sure that has nothing to do with hard work and being exposed to better competition, but rather where they live. Enjoy the ongoing discussions, I’ll show myself out. 

Because one example of a team working harder than another doesn't account for the bigger picture across the state and doesn't disprove my argument of the advantage there still is. Did you read the first sentence and skip the rest because you were so triggered? It's a debate. It's fine. You can tell me I'm an idiot and you're right. That's fine. 
That's why I broadened my talking points outside our district. BG has an advantage due to being private, but to what extent if at all is that exploited? probably little, but we know the girls had exploited before. My point is you can't take this one example and say therefore the rest are okay. Prepared is one thing, skilled is another. Preparation can only take someone so far, they need talent which isn't always fairly acquired.
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Re: Thursday Scoreboard 2-28-19

Postby upnorth » March 5th, 2019, 1:04 pm

All a school district boundary defines is essentially local tax rates. All 500 school districts in the state have open boundaries concerning enrollment. All you have to do is pay tuition. Don't like Greater Johnstown and would like to attend Richland or Westmont? Go for it. And since GJ is classified by PDE as a "low achieving" school (as is Williamsburg) you can even get receive a scholarship to offset some or all of the tuition.

For the record, I have no problem with separate playoffs, but be careful what you wish for. The cost of post-season play will rise significantly and will be passed along to all PIAA members. We will need three separate district/state playoffs: public boundary, public non-boundary and finally private.

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Re: Thursday Scoreboard 2-28-19

Postby Colonel Mustard » March 5th, 2019, 1:36 pm

St.Francis' former women's coach has one daughter playing for BC, because that's where her travel teammates play, and one daughter playing for BG, because that's where her travel teammates play. Something definitely seems wrong with a system that allows that.

Simple answer seems to be to have the privates play up a class or 2 to reflect the region they draw from, but I realize that nothing is simple.


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