Best offensive line discussion

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CCDevil2012
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Re: Best offensive line discussion

Postby CCDevil2012 » September 20th, 2019, 7:58 am

sasquatch260 wrote:Not to over complicate things, but there are a lot of variables involved in this discussion. i.e. talent, size, power, and toughness.
I've seen LV's line many times, and in terms of talent, size, and power - I've never seen a better high school O line.
BUT...
I don't see the toughness I saw on the smaller O lines of the 90s into the 00s (and probably earlier).

Not to be that old guy who exaggerates the superiority of the good old days. I do think kids today are probably generally bigger, stronger and maybe more talented. BUT they don't have the toughness we had in those days. I rarely see the same level of scrappiness and intensity on the O line. The desire to just destroy someone. Its there sometimes, but I don't see it nearly as much these days.

LV's line is definitely the strongest (4 500lb squatters and a 600+ lb squatter) and one of the biggest I've seen. But I'd like to put one of the United, FH or Tyrone lines of the 90s up against them. I think they'd be over matched by the toughness factor.

I respectfully disagree. I think this is a case of one generation always thinks they’re “more blank than blank” or “we’ll back in my day”. Toughness is a subjective trait, not something you can know unless you’re out there playing. There’s not a number you can put on it. I do think some players have more “toughness”, but it’s not a generational thing 



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Re: Best offensive line discussion

Postby CharlieConway » September 20th, 2019, 8:24 am

Would it be safe to say that student athletes today lift more than previous generations.  Many teams have strength programs that are now specialized and kept on their smartphones. Bigger, Faster, Stronger were the pioneers in the 90's and early 2000s, and were very effective.  Today there are many programs to choose from.  Schools have athletic trainers, some are more involved than others.  Regardless, my point is that I believe student athletes today are stronger than they ever have been.  

Therefore, comparing the athletes of today, in this case lineman and offensive lines, is very difficult.  

I would say an offensive line that dominates today, is the best today.  But, we shouldn't compare them to the past because purely how often these kids lift.  I can barely remember the weightroom being open in the offseason, and I don't recall athletes at other schools saying they were lifting either.  

Today, it is an integral part of the high school athletic experience.  

Teams of the past, lets not discredit their achievements due to the Ivan Dragos of today.  These kids are way bigger, and kids are just as mean as they were 40 years ago.  Obviously there were a few amazingly strong kids in the past, every team had a few; however today almost all kids on the field are lifters.  The gap between "ok" and "good" has shrunk, imo.  

I wouldn't discredit any achievements of the past, nor would I want try and prove that "old school" can still hang by having a "measuring contest" in the parking lot with these kids today.  

I haven't done a push up in about a decade; lol, each of the high school teams have probably lifted at least 3 times this week.
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Re: Best offensive line discussion

Postby Goldeneagles12 » September 20th, 2019, 9:42 am

I would agree kids are stronger today. The Toughness thing kids these days I dont think are as tough. It's not even there fault. Society has changed. Today  you can talk about how your feeling if your hurt to your friends and stuff kids are more open these days. Back in the 90s and before. It was rub some dirt on it dont be a sissy it's not broke your ok. So you just sucked it up and dealt with it. It's a good thing they are more cautious with things these days.

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Re: Best offensive line discussion

Postby CCDevil2012 » September 20th, 2019, 10:00 am

Goldeneagles12 wrote:I would agree kids are stronger today. The Toughness thing kids these days I dont think are as tough. It's not even there fault. Society has changed. Today  you can talk about how your feeling if your hurt to your friends and stuff kids are more open these days. Back in the 90s and before. It was rub some dirt on it dont be a sissy it's not broke your ok. So you just sucked it up and dealt with it. It's a good thing they are more cautious with things these days.

I guess I see it this way. Jerry Jones was a starting guard for Arkansas on a National Championship at 6’0”, 182 lbs. Yet Colin Smith was “too small” to play QB at 6’1” 200+. No one is questioning Jerry Jones toughness, but let’s not pretend the linemen of today are less tough at 300lbs. Society has changed yes, but football players are football players. I know I’m comparing High school to college but you get the point. 

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Re: Best offensive line discussion

Postby Colonel Mustard » September 20th, 2019, 10:19 am

Anyone see the interview with Cam Newton wearing a babushka tied under his chin? Don't tell me players are just as 'tough' now as they used to be. And all of these injuries now, were just normal aches and pains back then. Yes, the old-time tough guys may have all dropped dead in their 50s, but they were definitely tougher (or dumber), not sure which??

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Re: Best offensive line discussion

Postby CharlieConway » September 20th, 2019, 10:38 am

I like this discussion. No one slamming anyone.

Tough - thats another difficult word to define.

Lets take "The Greatest Generation to Ever Live" (Coined by Tom Brokaw).

Toughness is defined by opportunity.  Those born in the 1910's and 1920's had the opportunity to prove their toughness and well exceeded expectations and you can look no further than Normandy.  

Hopefully this generation, or those in the future, never have to prove their "toughness."

That being said, all of your comments got me thinking.  

Think back to being a teenagers and all the "weird" stuff you may or may not have done.  I think I turned out ok, but I def had some "weird" moments.  I am so grateful there was not a 200 mpbs internet connection in my room when I was 13.  I doubt I would have had the discipline to be granted a smartphone.  My buddies and I would have made some of the dumbest decisions with one of those handy.  Or take into account social media, where we can say what we want without much consequence.

I think sometimes that just maybe it is pretty hard to be a kid these days with all the things they have going on around them.   Its tough to navigate adolescence, lots of pitfalls.  Camera phones and Snapchats.

Maybe this generation faces a different "tough."  

I dunno, if you get what I am trying to say.
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Re: Best offensive line discussion

Postby Goldeneagles12 » September 20th, 2019, 11:53 am

Colonel Mustard wrote:Anyone see the interview with Cam Newton wearing a babushka tied under his chin?  Don't tell me players are just as 'tough' now as they used to be.  And all of these injuries now, were just normal aches and pains back then.  Yes, the old-time tough guys may have all dropped dead in their 50s, but they were definitely tougher (or dumber), not sure which??

This is what I was saying. Back then you played through it cause that's what was expected of you and instilled in an early age. Hell water breaks were taboo in the olden days. Now you tell your coach what is up it's more transparent. Not the kids fault at all. Just the way it is now. Which is good it will save your body down the road. 

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Re: Best offensive line discussion

Postby Crimson's Ghost » September 20th, 2019, 12:31 pm

Guys were tough then, guys are tough now. 

The equipment before used to suck, so when you got hit, you felt it every time and they still got up and kept playing. It’s insane  

Equipment is better now, but defensive linemen are 6-5 290 and run 4.4 40’s. So yea it’s just crazy the caliber of athletes there are today. 

So say what you will about Cam Newton, but that guy gets hit as much as anyone. 

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Re: Best offensive line discussion

Postby CCDevil2012 » September 20th, 2019, 12:40 pm

Say what you want about Cam’s clothing choices, but he has 2” and 30lbs on Terry Bradshaw and gets hit a ton by physical specimens that could have been bitten by radioactive spiders. They’re all tough 

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Re: Best offensive line discussion

Postby Crimson's Ghost » September 20th, 2019, 12:43 pm

Getting sacked in 1970 and getting sacked in 2019 both would suck.


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