Steelers

[GoldenRamsFAN]

I dont know what you call elite then as coaching. Since he was hired only one coach can say theyve been to and won more superbowls, there have only been other 5 coaches who can say they have been to as many superbowls and won a superbowl. None of them can say they havent had a losing season.


What is qualifying an elite coach over the past 15 years? Is the only elite coach billy b in new england?

There are only 5 active coaches with 2 or more sb appearances. Andy Reid just did it 2 years in a row.

[Capnweird]

To echo something that was said before, we have to stop comparing this era of sports, especially the NFL to the eras before the salary cap. Chuck Noll was a fantastic coach and evaluator of talent there is no denying that. But, he never had to worry about Joe Greene leaving for a more lucrative contract, or Jack Hamm going to a team where he could be THE GUY on the defense. The players of that era stayed with the team that drafted them because they had no other choice.

If a modern coach could keep every single guy on his team then we can compare them, but the truth is players can leave for many reasons. THe simple truth about Steelers players is when they leave to play for other coaches most, certainly not all, but most of them are not nearly as good as they were in Pittsburgh. There has to be some understanding of that and see that there is a reason for that and it isn't the fans.

Tomlin is no perfect coach for sure, but he has been hamstrung by a quarterback that took up a huge amount of his team's salary cap for nearly a decade. If they did not have a guy that was getting paid so much at that position they could have afforded to give Bell and Brown what they wanted, of course there is no denying what Brown turned into once he got his money, and that Bell's skills disappeared in New Jersey.
The simply truth is the salary cap changed the game, and has to have changed the way we look at coaches. I don't know why people are so upset at him right now anyway as I certainly didn't expect this team to be undefeated at this point in the season, and this team is definitely not a Super Bowl talented team either, not with the offensive line that they have, and remember you only have so many picks in a draft, so you can only do so much through that.

[OutOfTheLoop]

More evidence is that there were 3 different back-to-back Super Bowl winners in the 70s but only 1 so far this century (and that one was almost 20 years ago). Obviously New England has been the exception to the rule but a decade run of a great team is a thing of the past.

The NFL is now designed for parity and you're lucky to hold the core of a good team together for 1 or 2 legitimate shots at the title. The fact Tomlin has never had a losing season is really remarkable.

[Penn1971]

I chuckle when contemporary Steeler fans complain about comparisons of coaches based on an “era.”

Bill Bellichick has demonstrated that the logic used by Tomlin-lovers is simply what is called a “red herring.”

What you need to do is compare the coaches of each era to one another. For instance, during the 1970s, the NFL had three coaches who became hall of famers: Don Shula, Tom Landry, and the one who won the most Super Bowls, Chuck Noll.

To understand how good they were, look at their records during that era and their head to head competition.

And then using the same logic, compare Mike Tomlin to Bill Bellichick. That record will reveal that there has only been one, and maybe two, elite coaches in the past 15 years — and a guy who won a Super Bowl in which he inherited a tremendous amount of talent from his predecessor — who also underachieved in big games -- is not one of them. Tomlin has won just three times and lost a slew against Bellichick, to say nothing about the Super Bowl victories.

Tomlin is a decent coach, but elite? To say that they Steelers cannot do better is ludicrous. That is what many people said when Tomlin, who had never even been a coordinator, was hired. He did well at first until he decided to be a “players coach” and did away with the discipline that he used in his first years.

Tomlin has had outstanding offensive skilled players in the past decade plus, and some pretty decent defensive players. However, he has underachieved in the area in which elite coaches are determined: The playoffs.

[knowitall]

LOL! There are no elite coaches and it’s equally ludicrous to think the Steelers could do better. Most teams have not done better. What Bill Belichick did in New England is an outlier. No one compares. Steeler fans are spoiled little bitches. The truth is the Steelers have won two Super Bowls in 42 years. And another truth is few teams have done better. It’s a 32 team league.

[konjo78]

I chuckle when contemporary Steeler fans complain about comparisons of coaches based on an “era.”

Bill Bellichick has demonstrated that the logic used by Tomlin-lovers is simply what is called a “red herring.”

What you need to do is compare the coaches of each era to one another. For instance, during the 1970s, the NFL had three coaches who became hall of famers: Don Shula, Tom Landry, and the one who won the most Super Bowls, Chuck Noll.

To understand how good they were, look at their records during that era and their head to head competition.

And then using the same logic, compare Mike Tomlin to Bill Bellichick. That record will reveal that there has only been one, and maybe two, elite coaches in the past 15 years — and a guy who won a Super Bowl in which he inherited a tremendous amount of talent from his predecessor — who also underachieved in big games -- is not one of them. Tomlin has won just three times and lost a slew against Bellichick, to say nothing about the Super Bowl victories.

Tomlin is a decent coach, but elite? To say that they Steelers cannot do better is ludicrous. That is what many people said when Tomlin, who had never even been a coordinator, was hired. He did well at first until he decided to be a “players coach” and did away with the discipline that he used in his first years.

Tomlin has had outstanding offensive skilled players in the past decade plus, and some pretty decent defensive players. However, he has underachieved in the area in which elite coaches are determined: The playoffs.

You made a point about comparing coaches to other in their era and then only compared tomlin to 1 coach. Compare tomlin to all the other coaches of the era then. Andy Reid has been to 3 superbowls if you count before tomlin was hired and won 1. Even Andy had bad enough losing seasons they he got fired from Philly. Pete Carroll has made 2 superbowls, winning 1 like tomlin, and he has had horrible losing seasons with seattle unlike tomlin. Sean Mcvay has had 2 superbowl appearances and losing seasons. Same with Sean Payton.


So like if you are comparing tomlin to coaches of his era he is top 3 in wins, superbowls, division titles and winning seasons. If you are going to talk about comparing him to coaches of this era atleast do that instead of plucking one coach no one in NFL history compares to

[OutOfTheLoop]

I chuckle when contemporary Steeler fans complain about comparisons of coaches based on an “era.”

Bill Bellichick has demonstrated that the logic used by Tomlin-lovers is simply what is called a “red herring.”

What you need to do is compare the coaches of each era to one another. For instance, during the 1970s, the NFL had three coaches who became hall of famers: Don Shula, Tom Landry, and the one who won the most Super Bowls, Chuck Noll.

To understand how good they were, look at their records during that era and their head to head competition.

And then using the same logic, compare Mike Tomlin to Bill Bellichick. That record will reveal that there has only been one, and maybe two, elite coaches in the past 15 years — and a guy who won a Super Bowl in which he inherited a tremendous amount of talent from his predecessor — who also underachieved in big games -- is not one of them. Tomlin has won just three times and lost a slew against Bellichick, to say nothing about the Super Bowl victories.

Tomlin is a decent coach, but elite? To say that they Steelers cannot do better is ludicrous. That is what many people said when Tomlin, who had never even been a coordinator, was hired. He did well at first until he decided to be a “players coach” and did away with the discipline that he used in his first years.

Tomlin has had outstanding offensive skilled players in the past decade plus, and some pretty decent defensive players. However, he has underachieved in the area in which elite coaches are determined: The playoffs.

So who would you replace Tomlin with since you state there are better options?

[EnzoLigoniere]

Sean Payton and promote Brian Flores to defensive coordinator
The present nfl is heavy on the offense, a mind like Payton with a young Pickett to mold , along with weapons like Najee, Pickens and Friermuth would be better than Matt Canada's offense

[OutOfTheLoop]

Sean Payton and promote Brian Flores to defensive coordinator
The present nfl is heavy on the offense, a mind like Payton with a young Pickett to mold , along with weapons like Najee, Pickens and Friermuth would be better than Matt Canada's offense

So Payton is elite while Tomlin is not. Interesting, but the facts don't reflect your feelings.

Each coached for 13 seasons, each has 1 SB trophy, very similar regular season records (Tomlin slightly better), very similar post season records (Payton slightly better), Tomlin has 1 more conference title, 1 more playoffs achieved, Tomlin is 8 years younger, and Payton was suspended for a season.

Wow! What a tremendous upgrade!

[CCDevil2012]

Sean Payton and promote Brian Flores to defensive coordinator
The present nfl is heavy on the offense, a mind like Payton with a young Pickett to mold , along with weapons like Najee, Pickens and Friermuth would be better than Matt Canada's offense

So Payton is elite while Tomlin is not. Interesting, but the facts don't reflect your feelings.

Each coached for 13 seasons, each has 1 SB trophy, very similar regular season records (Tomlin slightly better), very similar post season records (Payton slightly better), Tomlin has 1 more conference title, 1 more playoffs achieved, Tomlin is 8 years younger, and Payton was suspended for a season.

Wow! What a tremendous upgrade!

These are excellent points and is a great example of how many Steelers fans think a change to a coach with a lesser record would some how be an upgrade.

Furthermore, both coaches have had a HoF QB with Brees being better IMO